The Church and Technology

Hey Family,

I am surveying the community of believers, in reference to the Black Church, and its usage of teachnology/internet.

I would appreciate it if you could respond to these questions:

Do you feel that the Black church uses technology/internet to its advangtage?


Does your pastor/church use facebook or email to communicate with you?



Do you use facebook to gain insight on what people feel about God/scripture/life's questions?


How do you feel technology can be used to benefit/hurt the Black Church?


Do you blog? Does your church blog? Do you even know what blogging is?


Thank you for your answers in advance

Charles Dorsey

Malcolm's Assassin Released! WHAT!!!

Hey guys,

Malcolm X (Little) Killer was released!

I am curious as to what you think about this

it is all over the news.

What message is this sending to the society?
How does this make you feel to know that someone who murdered a significant figure is free?

I have mixed feeling as a person who wishes there was an opportunity to speak with many historical figures.

What do you think

Blacks Don't go to College!

Hey guys,

I read this article about High School Students graduating and going to college.
A whole class graduates and goes to college

I have a serious problem with this and I need to know your thoughts.

Why are we surprised and celebratory when something happens that should happen.
Black Young Men graduate and go to college and we celebrate!!!

It does not mean that they will graduate, receive the support they need to successful in college, or mean that they are free from challenges that exist in their community.

Why are we celebrating this!!! We are and have been qualified for the longest! College is the standard! not some great feat! (call me when they all get into graduate school!)

I have gotten this new over my email many times (a please continue to send them) But I am DISTURBED!

What say you?

Google Vs Facebook

Last week Facebook topped Google as the most visited site.

The theory going around is that Google is tipping the scales with an increasing audience of internet users.

The theories include

people use the internet for information
people use the internet to discover theology
people use the internet to learn

But this article seems to hammer home the point that people are beginning to socialize and develop a community online.

Will Facebook and virtual communication emerge as the new and only way of community? Will the value of face to face interaction be lost?

here is one theory....what say you?

Help the Church

If you could offer some advice to churches, or a specific church, what would you say?
Please be honest

Theology After Google Conference

We just finished the Theology After Google Conference.

It was a great success. We had some of the nations leading internet theologians inform us about a new way of thinking.

Key statements:

- Our Current generation is a generation of experience not theory
- Giving is the key to church growth
- Theology After Google must move beyond the wall of the church
- In relation to other ideologies, the church must not be afraid to be open to alternative views
- church has to be about processes

a key statement

If we don’t inherently trust the people you will never maximize the opportunity the internet offers

I just wanted to say that if you missed this conference you missed out

C

Jeff Jarvis is NUTTS!!

Hey Guys, (the title is not personal...I am sure he is a nice guy)

So I just got done listening to Jeff Jarvis author of "What Would Google do?" a new york times best seller. He skyped into the Theology After Google conference on March 11th.

He was saying something interesting but then again it was almost impractical.

He believe that all a person information should be put online. He says that the more publicly we operate the better off we will be.

Problems:

Cultural responses to openness vary
Being open is subjective
The truth is everyone does not want to know everything about you
Being open sometimes cost you everything
Dealing with judgement of others


He also said by being online and not being open you don't exist

I simply disagree. People recreate themselves online. This is problematic also but you do exist. In fact you exist in ways that are difficult to validate. What about the people who use the Internet as a fantasy land Jeff? What does google say about them?

I love the theory or a Utopian openness online but it is not practical.

Other cultural implications

Ex: My mother brought me up making it very clear that there are some things that don't need to be known. Don't go in your mothers room, don't go in your mothers stuff, don't ask your mother certain things because you are too young to understand or it is none of your business

What about the influences the contextual information has on young people who see it Jeff? Will we empower our society to be exposed to information too early?


The lecture was great but these things are problematic

Nobody likes the DMV

I have had my share of DMV experiences and none of them were pleasant

There are always
1 long lines
2 dry customer service
3 irritable customers
4 long waiting times
5 other issues besides what you went there for

Thank God they finally take debit cards because there was a time when they were only doing cash.

This is a survey of how many people actually have a "DMV story"

Let me know

Christians and Other Religions

Hey guys,

I am a Christian and I love Jesus Christ. I do however have a problem with some Christian practices and I have a question...maybe two.

How does God call Christians to engage other faith traditions?
Why are Christians so comfortable openly condemning and criticizing other religions as a means to evangelize?

Anyone have a comment? I mean what does our faith teach us to do?

Talk with Brian McLaren

I just spoke with Brian McLaren author of "A New Kind of Christianity" via skype. This mess was so cool!!

This guy is a nationally and internationally known author. We got to speak about his view on Jesus. I told him about how I interpreted his statement and he caution me to be careful about how you introduce new progressive ideas about Christianity.

I must be honest and say that the conversation was very pleasant. His view on his Christianity is almost inspiring. It seems that progressive theologians can't be true Christains and progressive.

Brian is down to earth and confident in his faith in Christ. I am going to reread his new book and I encourage you to do the same

C

Will the Church live?

Generation X and the Millennials are not joining churches.

Churches are getting older and in danger of existinction.

people sleep, play gold, exercise, vacation, or get pamphered on sundays instead of service. Has the church lost its groove?

What is the solution to this problem

Your thoughts please

Sex: pornography

Hey

I know this is a taboo subject but I would love for some insight.

Is pornography bad?

Is it a sin to watch/purchase/or masturbate to pornography?

I have always wondered what others thought about this question


Your thoughts Please

The Contextual Jesus!

Two and a half Questions

Why are there so many interpretations of Jesus?


Do you feel like your interpretation is the right/only one? Why

The Real Jesus!

Question: Who is the Real Jesus! Who is Jesus to you? What does he do? What doesn't he do?

Lets face it, the Bible means different things to different people! As a consequence Jesus means different things to different people! This is a known fact.

By what standard to we accept these different meanings as valid? I am frankly saturated with the various views on Jesus, God, and all this other theological theory. How can a new believer know what to believe with all of this variety.

Brian McLaren (brief biography)in his new book A New Kind of Christianity address the different ideas of Jesus through the hilarious and ridiculous comedy "Talladega Nights."

He makes these points

- People are still tempted to define Jesus the way they want Jesus to be

- Old opinion and view will produce Old interpretations and Old applications

- The interpretation of Jesus found in the Book of Revelation (19:11-16) was appropriate for the time that the author was writing. It was also appropriate for the context and challenges of that day

- Jesus in the book of Revelation is the same as Jesus in the Gospels

- Jesus has not adapted to methods of peacemaking that were used by the Greco Roman rulers and government. In other words, Jesus still plans to use peace to bring peace

As a result Mc Laren concludes this:

- All interpretations of Jesus are NOT CORRECT! IN FACT SOME OF THEM ARE UNACCEPTABLE!

- Jesus coming back to KILL IS INACCURATE! (see revelation 19)

- Jesus is strong even though he will not use violence as a means of salvation

Now,

The question still remains....Who is the Real Jesus! Who is Jesus to you?

What a Minister Should NEVER Do!

Should you put all of your information up on line for people to see as an individual? Should it be true? If you are a minister should you put your personal information online

One author says

• “Make sure every possible bit of information that anyone could want to know about you in on the web, searchable by Google” (page 44 of What Would Google Do? By Jeff Jarvis)

Can we please talk about this!!!

Google Rules!! My thoughts

Theology After Google

These are just some of my thought on the “What Would Google Do?” by Jeff Jarvis
• The book begins stating that if you give people control they will use it
o This is very true but it only works for the informed individual. How can a person take advantage of resources if they don’t know how to use it? Computer literacy and internet literacy is complicated to the mind that doesn’t understand technology. What about the group of people who can’t afford computers and don’t have readily access to technology? What about the people who are not only impoverished but are in a climate that generates fear so that accessing public resources is equated to risking one’s life? What about those people who are faithful to their old and beat up phone refusing to upgrade to a phone that would allow them to access the internet? Is human intuition and curiosity that strong? Are people willing to be empowered simply because they are invited to? Is empowerment an innate or transferable ability? Can people who fall into these categories really ask the question, what would Google do? Or is our first task to tell them what Google is and teach them how to use Google?

In conclusion, you can’t empower the uninformed simply by giving them control. You must educate the person and introduce them to the tool you have given them before they can ever use or even responsibly control anything. People only like to control things that they understand. Those things that are beyond understanding are useless. I believe that these are the types of people that come into church frequently and this is what they are met with. They are met with useful but useless information. The information would be good if the people actually had a computer or had a mean to use a computer or even had training. There has to be a preliminary effort to provide a technological consciousness to the people we are offering the new developments of our society.

• Another statement says “when you hand over control you start winning” pg 21

o I can agree with this statement. I think it is really appropriate for ministry but dangerous depending on the leadership or ecclesiastical structure you find yourself in. Some traditions pay their leaders to keep control and take control. Some people, especially pastors, bishops, and the like, are paid to listen to the people but still do their own (which they call God’s) will. So, my question then speaks to the definition of winning. What does the author mean?

• About the worst and best customer and their role in your business or success

o This statement is absolutely correct but difficult in praxis. Your worst customer has the potential to get on your last and only nerve. Your worst customer cost you the most time and really doesn’t communicate in a way you would prefer. It takes a level of humility to deal with your worst customer. I do believe however that if the church can understand the genius in actually listening to the complaints of the people they would be better off. The solution, in the book, was not necessarily to make the exact change as much as let the people know you were listening to their dilemmas, problems, and challenges. When the people received a response that indicated that the representative actually listened to their complaint, the customer was drawn into an attitude of joy and delight. The key is listening to your customers, both good and bad. For the church, the key is to listen to your criticism and your celebrations. They can end up being a great blessing for your ministry

• Be a platform (page 32 of Theology after Google)

o This concept was so important to me. It is so applicable. The reading suggests creating a place for people to free address their problems and freely express their gifts. That is what Google does. It offers freedom. The church can learn a very valuable lesson from this. I currently pastor a young adult church and one of our methods is to provide a space for people to express their gifts. People take ownership when they are free to express. Expression improves as opportunities stabilize. Freedom becomes productive when it is offered in a religious space. I am not talking about the freedom that accompanies many people who are drunk with power. I am speaking of the humble freedom that allows the individual to humbly articulate, courageously express, and proudly display. BE A PLATFORM; YES!!! This is the key to building ministry and touching lives.

• “Make sure every possible bit of information that anyone could want to know about you in on the web, searchable by Google” (page 44 of What Would Google Do? By Jeff Jarvis)

o This is a rule that draws a fine line between private and public. Jeff Jarvis seems to believe that virtual or cyber publicness is the same as reality. I disagree with every fiber of my being. When you are always a public person there is no time for private. I believe that there are some things that should be kept private. As a preacher and all preachers should know this, the people can’t put up with being able to search out and search up your whole life. Now, if we are talking about the new and improved life, put it on the internet. If we are only talking about the life that people can see, put it up on line. If we are talking about the stuff that will cause people to publically, privately, and virtually persecutes us; the stuff that will empty out the building that has a 25,000 payment due every month; the place that continues to be the sources of the funding for the electricity that runs the computer; DO NOT PUT IT ON LINE. The statement above says “every possible bit of information.” I strongly disagree for, and not limited to, the reasons I mentioned above!

Can Young Pastors survive Tradition?

So, Chad and Professor Clayton have partially articulated a piece of their understanding concerning seminaries and how they prepare or don't prepare students. They have then addressed the very sensitive topic about those who are selected to pastor and tend to the suffering churches all over the land

Please read their posts here about 1/3 of the way down

Now I have something to say about this because I am a seminary student (Claremont School of Theology) and a member of the AME (African Methodist Epsiscopal) Church. I have some opinions about both of the topics mentioned above.

Professor Clayton,

I certainly agree with the fact that young pastor are not place in ideal circumstances when they are finally allowed to pastor churches. It is true that most church, especially irrelevant churches, have a constituency of people who are used to the traditional style of church. They are less likely to know about on coming technologies. I don't believe however that this means that a persons idealism has to be put away. I do not have all the answers to the challenge that you mentioned. As a young minister, I can empathize with the difficulty of preaching and teaching old audiences. I can empathize with the reality of trying to introduce new things. This is difficult. But one of the things I can say is that there is hope.

Seminary has hopefully taught students to think critically and study. There has to be a point where the ministry consults the art of study. The person has to begin to seek insight through psychology and studies about the culture of change. How do you merge into a context instead of bursting into the context? How do you respect your elders and allow them to understand your perspective without emptying the church? How do you use language that is familiar to communicate accurately? These are huge challenges and like I said I don't have the answers but if seminary is teaching me anything, it is the art of thinking critically which should prove to be universally advantages.

Chad:

Oh boy, you hit an interesting spot in my consciousness. I disagree with the fact that the denominations are not to blame. I think denominations have the ability to be super traditional. You can't blame the seminaries because the seminaries have a certain purpose. The provide students with the ability to think about the religiousity of theology. They don't equip people with the skills to deal with people. Denominations have to do a better job at discerning the people they place into position of power. If the churches reputation was not so challenges and preacers/people (all christians) were a little more responsible there would probably be an abundance of people to choose from which would likely produce better fits for more traditional churches. Unfortunately this is not the case.

My other challenge with your statement is that denominations keep getting let off the hook. The denominations have to figure out a way to reach out to these seminaries. Why aren't more denominations trying to partner with seminaries to offer theological and practical forms of ministry. The reason why most students are inequipped is because those (denominations) who have the practical experiences (they are the majority) are irresponsibly rejecting opportunity to send experience into the classroom that theory might be introduced to praxis. I am talking about for all denominations (even non-denominational which is also a denomination).

It is time for people to stop pointing fingers anyway because it does not yield results.

And concerning your opinions about managers and leaders. I have recently been reading leadership books and have become familiar with the distinctione between the two. I don't know that most churches have either or. I think churches are struggling to understand which technique are appropriate at which time for which situation. Praxis is difficult and I think that has yet to be mentioned in the conversation. Church is not easy. Look at Jesus. Ask the text if Church is easy. Look at the message of Christ. If it was easy everyone would have it and everyone would understand it. Everyone does not understand it.

The Praxis of pastoral ministry is a lost are and underrated. We must respect the craft and understand the task. Dealing with people, especially in the area of spirituality, is a world of its own. I guess I am trying to say you have to be well rounded (both manager and leader) to survive.

Thelogy after Google: Responses to Chad and Professor Clayton

So I don't know if I am going to get through all of this because it is late and I am tired indeed but let me know what you think

Claytons article says:

But what church actually is has always been deeply affected by the world around it. When that world changes, so too does church. Everyone acknowledges that we are living in a time of revolutionary change. So tell me why we don’t think church is in for some radical changes?

Chad disputes

What the church actually is should be affected by what her Lord has called her to be, not what the world dictates. I think this is setting the bar far too low. What if, instead, the world was deeply affected by the Church within it? That is a far more radical idea and one that I think the church has long given up on ever since it married with the state as far back as Constantine.

I do agree that a church has to be affected by its context, which is the world around it. I think there is a problem with the way these responses are defining world. What is the world of a particular church? What is the world of the church in general? Is a church expected to meet the needs of every single person on this earth? Or is the church supposed to be specific? I think the challenge with many churches today is trying to meet the needs of the world. There are people right outside the any churches door that continue to display the actually needs of the "world" around the church. Instead the church looks at the news papers and television in order to assess what it should be doing. The work of the church or your church is right outside. It is amazing how sometimes thing that church needs to be affected by become invinsible in exchange for what someone else sees in the world.

In fact, if i may take a commercial, this is where the church and theology after Google must be careful. There has to be a point where we look beyond the screen to our physical environment. Our theology has to consider the real people that are right outside and sometimes within our homes. My concern is that theology after google might not contribute to the efforts of those right outside of our door. People may began to become addicted to e-evangelism and e- ministry and e- helping that seeing people and touching people becomes irrelevant. In this way, I can understand why technology can become a threat to the church and its mission. Many church mission encourage people to leave the comfort of their homes and their churches to go and touch and be with the people. I mean what about that?

If I may get back to the point, I would contribute to Phillip Claytons opinion by posing some question:

Professor Clayton: If the church changes with the world then why aren't more churches adapting to the changes in their community? Why are the messages still spiritual and less practical? (yes that is a contextual generalization) Why is the church still separate? Why are there still huge churches in poor places?

Chad:

I certainly catch your drift about being affected more by the call of the lord moreso than the world, but I do believe that God call us to be in touch with those around us. It seems like your comment excluded the necessity of listening, feeling, and addressing the world we live it. It is a reality that the world is changing. It is a reality that the church is on the brink of extinction because the church is holding on to call that are ceturies old (or should I say continuing to package the call in ancient wrapping paper). Can't the church change with the world and still be in line with God's will? Does the idea of change have to lead to the change of the core message of Christ?

I don't think so. I think we can preach loving your neighbor in different clothes with a different discourse. In fact, I think it is more than necessary.

see more of what i addressing by clicking here

Women Dominating

Hello Family,

I went onto the facebook page from out Theology after Google class and read one of the wall postings. I had some interesting feelings on it and before I let you know what my feeling where I think you should take some time to glance at it

If you wish to read it (HIGHLY RECOMMENDED) click here

have you read it

okay here is my response.

Let me know what you think

Okay so i Read this article and as a social man I disagree. I really think that the amount of women on a particular site does not dictate their dominance.

In my opinion, and no disrespect, I think that theory is poor because it leaves no room for history. Historically, those who outnumber never dominate. Slaves, Women, different races....in most of the catergories i just mention dominance is not dictated by numbers.

It is however dictated by influence. Now, the article says that we can think of a bunch of male names right off the back. That is because, unfortunately in the unjust world, there has been a history of male dominance or mysogynistic rule, or patriarchy. However you wish to say it. If you don't know the meaning of these words just look it up at www.dictionary.com.... See More

But my point is based on theory and I think that theory carries over into social media. The numbers don't dictate dominance. The numbers are simply numbers

looking to hear from ya

questions questions questions

I just want to admit that I am a bit confused concerning the Theology After Google class. I am not sure what we are supposed to be doing but one thing is for sure. I am going to give this blogging and internet thing my best shot. I have not felt like this since my first computer so if you want to keep up with this process...tune in to my blog almost daily...see what comes up